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conversion optimizer questions

Follower ✭ ✭ ☆
# 1
Follower ✭ ✭ ☆

I have few questions about conversion optimizer and flexible bidding strategies.

#1:
I understand that in order to activate conversion optimizer at the campaign level, campaign must have a minimum of 15 conversions in the last 30 days.
Does conversion optimizer, when making bid decisions, uses even older data?

#2:
Regarding flexible bidding strategy target CPA:
If I have a campaign with 100 ad groups and want to apply flexible bidding strategy based on a target CPA only to 20 ad groups:
- is it necessary that each ad group has 15 conversions in the last 30 days or
- is it enough that those 20 ad groups combined have 15 conversions in the last 30 days or
- is it enough that the entire campaign has 15 conversions in the last 30 days although CPA bidding will be enabled only in 20 ad groups

#3
If target CPA bidding is enabled in only few ad groups and other ad groups in the same campaign are on manual bidding will conversion optimizer when making bid decisions use data (regarding geo, time of the day, device...) only from ad groups where it is activated or from the entire campaign?

Thanks!

2 Expert replyverified_user
1 ACCEPTED SOLUTION

Accepted Solutions
Marked as Best Answer.
Solution
Accepted by topic author Dragan Pozder
September 2015

Re: conversion optimizer questions

Top Contributor
# 6
Top Contributor
Hi Dragansedam,
Some EXCELLENT questions.

Seeing 1 has already been answered, I'll focus on 2 and 3.

2) - is it necessary that each ad group has 15 conversions in the last 30 days or is it enough that those 20 ad groups combined have 15 conversions in the last 30 days or
is it enough that the entire campaign has 15 conversions in the last 30 days although CPA

_ You're not going to like this, but each AD GROUP that you enable flexible CPA on will need 15 conversions.

3) Flexible Target CPA (I assume that's what you're taling about here too) will CONTINUE to use the data from the ENTIRE campaign and in fact, it will use data from the entire ACCOUNT too. When you think about it, this makes intuative sense. The data that conversion optimizer uses is based on the geo, time of day, browser, the device and other targeting options. So while the keywords may be different in your FCPA ad groups, a lot of what AdWords uses to actually optimize for conversions, comes from other parts of the account, including other ad groups in the same campaign.


Hope that helps.

PS: Some good reference docs are here: https://support.google.com/adwords/answer/2979071?hl=en

https://support.google.com/adwords/answer/2471188

View solution in original post

Re: conversion optimizer questions

Google Employee
# 2
Google Employee

Hi dragansedam,

 

Thanks for your post. These are great questions. 

 

  1. Yes. You are correct in understanding that the campaign must have a minimum of 15 conversions in the last 30 days. Conversion Optimizer uses all Conversion (AdWords) and/or imported Goal Tracking data (Google Analytics), but it weighs recent data more heavily.
  2. To address your question regarding CPA bidding on 20 ad groups and manual on the others, you can't have 2 biding strategies in one campaign. Keeping this in mind, I would recommend that you create a separate campaign for the 20 ad groups that you want to utilize CPA bidding with and leave the other ad groups to use manual/automatic bidding.
  3. If you were to leave all of your ad groups in 1 campaign and implement CPA bidding, your budget would be focused on the ad groups where you are currently seeing conversions. It's possible that the other ad groups without conversions would not perform as well as if you had used manual bidding. This is because this bid type is designed to focus on conversions and works best when you have a lot of historic conversion data.   

Hope that helps. 

Re: conversion optimizer questions

Follower ✭ ✭ ☆
# 3
Follower ✭ ✭ ☆
Thank you for your answer regarding #1

Regarding #2 " you can't have 2 biding strategies in one campaign"
How's that? Flexible bidding strategies allow CPA bidding to be enabled per ad group or even keyword.

It looks like you didn't understand my question #3, it is related to flexible bidding strategies.

Re: conversion optimizer questions

Google Employee
# 4
Google Employee

To clarify question 2, you should apply CPA to all 100 ad groups or just the 20 ad groups separately. This allows for the optimizer to collect the most accurate data. CPA works most effectively when it has been fed with a lot of data. 

 

To clarify question 3, this question would be solved if you split out the 20 into a different campaign and only applied CPA bidding to those and kept the rest as manual/automatic bidding.  

 

 

Re: conversion optimizer questions

Follower ✭ ✭ ☆
# 5
Follower ✭ ✭ ☆
Hello Shanea, thank you for your efforts in trying to help me.

It seems you don't understand my questions.
I don't have any problem that I need to solve, those are theoretical questions as I want to understand better how CPA bidding and flexible bidding strategies work so that I can know better when to use which strategy.

If you could give me straightforward answers to my questions #2 and #3, I would appreciate that a lot.
Thanks!
Marked as Best Answer.
Solution
Accepted by topic author Dragan Pozder
September 2015

Re: conversion optimizer questions

Top Contributor
# 6
Top Contributor
Hi Dragansedam,
Some EXCELLENT questions.

Seeing 1 has already been answered, I'll focus on 2 and 3.

2) - is it necessary that each ad group has 15 conversions in the last 30 days or is it enough that those 20 ad groups combined have 15 conversions in the last 30 days or
is it enough that the entire campaign has 15 conversions in the last 30 days although CPA

_ You're not going to like this, but each AD GROUP that you enable flexible CPA on will need 15 conversions.

3) Flexible Target CPA (I assume that's what you're taling about here too) will CONTINUE to use the data from the ENTIRE campaign and in fact, it will use data from the entire ACCOUNT too. When you think about it, this makes intuative sense. The data that conversion optimizer uses is based on the geo, time of day, browser, the device and other targeting options. So while the keywords may be different in your FCPA ad groups, a lot of what AdWords uses to actually optimize for conversions, comes from other parts of the account, including other ad groups in the same campaign.


Hope that helps.

PS: Some good reference docs are here: https://support.google.com/adwords/answer/2979071?hl=en

https://support.google.com/adwords/answer/2471188

Re: conversion optimizer questions

Follower ✭ ✭ ☆
# 7
Follower ✭ ✭ ☆
Hi Dave, thank you for your precise answer.

I am surprised to hear that flexible target CPA bidding will use data from the entire account. But now, when I think about it, it makes perfect sense since it is a shared strategy and it can more effective like that. Although, there are many situations where it would be useful if it is limited to the campaign level regarding usage of conv. rate data by geo, hour of day ... For example, if you have separate campaigns for separate product types such as men clothing/women clothing or mountain trips/seaside trips.
Does Conversion Optimizer (not flexible one but the one that's per campaign) uses data only from that particular campaign or it also reaches for data from other campaigns?

Re: conversion optimizer questions

Top Contributor
# 8
Top Contributor
Hi Draganedam,
The "original" conversion optimizer has always been a mystery to me Smiley Happy So much so that I have RARELY used it. As far as I knew, it only used data from that CAMPAIGN. I may be wrong on that though. It's why I was so excited when the flexible CPA was announced as I thought it would be better an take more data points into account.

The jury is still out though. Be careful and always be testing.

Re: conversion optimizer questions

Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭
# 9
Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭
I've heard that conversion optimizer and dco uses data from any campaign with the specified domain in the destination url, even if the data resides on another account.

Re: conversion optimizer questions

Follower ✭ ✭ ☆
# 10
Follower ✭ ✭ ☆
That's interesting. Destination url or display url?
Official info on details how CO works would be nice.