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Three Question Regarding EFPB & ETPB

Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭
# 1
Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭

In a recent conversation in the PPC Pro People group at LinkedIn folks have said:

 

  • Estimated First Page Bid (EFPB) and Estimated Top Page Bid (ETPB) are calculated weekly.

 

  • Estimated First Page Bid (EFPB) and Estimated Top Page Bid (ETPB) are based only on Google Search…not Search Partners or Display.

 

Elsewhwere, I’ve also heard that Estimated First Page Bid (EFPB) and Estimated Top Page Bid (ETPB) are based only on exact match searches.

 

Are any of these statements true?

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Accepted by Mini-CM (Community Manager)
September 2015

Re: Three Question Regarding EFPB & ETPB

Top Contributor
# 2
Top Contributor

Hi MikeInMiami,

 

1. I really don't know how often they are calculated.

2. True.

3. True. AdWords is unable to predict matching queries for broad and phrase match. QS, EFPB and ETPB are all based on the exact match of the keyword when you are looking at the AdWords UI. This is not true for the actual ad auction.

 

Best of Luck!

 

Pete

 

petebardo -- Deadhead doing AdWords

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Accepted by topic author MikeInMiami
September 2015

Re: Three Question Regarding EFPB & ETPB

Top Contributor
# 3
Top Contributor

Hello MikeInMiami; welcome;

I saw that; but did not comment. ( There is a limit to the misconceptions I can correct on various forums.... Smiley Surprised)

 

Google does not disclose how often the data base is updated. Practically, it does not matter match, since this is an estimation, that has  a margin of error.

let's say that the first bid estimation is 1 dollar +- 20 cents. At some point it is changed to 1.08 +-20 cents. Would it make any difference for  your bid?:   For the first one you would bid for 1 dollar, and in the second for about 1.10. But, still the intrinsic margin of error could make  that you are wrong and need to higher the bid.

 

As long as Google does not disclose the margin of error, it is an estimate, a guideline, a point to start . Nothing more than that. A  rule  to remember in statistics: No number is NOT accurate, unless the error is reported.

 

In Google's words:

  • The first page bid estimate is a guide, meant to give you greater insight with which to plan your bidding strategy -- but meeting your first page bid estimate isn’t a guarantee of ad position. Ad position will still depend on Quality Score, your CPC bid, your budget and account settings, and user and advertiser behavior

-Moshe

Moshe, AdWords Top Contributor , Twitter | Linkedin | Community Profile | Ad-Globe
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View solution in original post

Marked as Best Answer.
Solution
Accepted by Mini-CM (Community Manager)
September 2015

Re: Three Question Regarding EFPB & ETPB

Top Contributor
# 2
Top Contributor

Hi MikeInMiami,

 

1. I really don't know how often they are calculated.

2. True.

3. True. AdWords is unable to predict matching queries for broad and phrase match. QS, EFPB and ETPB are all based on the exact match of the keyword when you are looking at the AdWords UI. This is not true for the actual ad auction.

 

Best of Luck!

 

Pete

 

petebardo -- Deadhead doing AdWords
Marked as Best Answer.
Solution
Accepted by topic author MikeInMiami
September 2015

Re: Three Question Regarding EFPB & ETPB

Top Contributor
# 3
Top Contributor

Hello MikeInMiami; welcome;

I saw that; but did not comment. ( There is a limit to the misconceptions I can correct on various forums.... Smiley Surprised)

 

Google does not disclose how often the data base is updated. Practically, it does not matter match, since this is an estimation, that has  a margin of error.

let's say that the first bid estimation is 1 dollar +- 20 cents. At some point it is changed to 1.08 +-20 cents. Would it make any difference for  your bid?:   For the first one you would bid for 1 dollar, and in the second for about 1.10. But, still the intrinsic margin of error could make  that you are wrong and need to higher the bid.

 

As long as Google does not disclose the margin of error, it is an estimate, a guideline, a point to start . Nothing more than that. A  rule  to remember in statistics: No number is NOT accurate, unless the error is reported.

 

In Google's words:

  • The first page bid estimate is a guide, meant to give you greater insight with which to plan your bidding strategy -- but meeting your first page bid estimate isn’t a guarantee of ad position. Ad position will still depend on Quality Score, your CPC bid, your budget and account settings, and user and advertiser behavior

-Moshe

Moshe, AdWords Top Contributor , Twitter | Linkedin | Community Profile | Ad-Globe
Did you find any helpful responses or answers to your query? If yes, please mark it as the ‘Best Answer’

Re: Three Question Regarding EFPB & ETPB

Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭
# 4
Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭

Thanks Pete!

Re: Three Question Regarding EFPB & ETPB

Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭
# 5
Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭

Moshe

I agree when the estimated bid is generated does not matter much...I'm just curious about how these Metrics work.

Whether partners or display is included or whether only exact match is used could on the other hand, may be issues that could affect performance if folks are applying estimated bids in places where they just aren't relevant.

 

Thanks for your response.

 

Mike 

Re: Three Question Regarding EFPB & ETPB

Top Contributor
# 6
Top Contributor

@MikeInMiami

My experience: those estimates, can serve as "the first shot"...Not much more than that...

Moshe, AdWords Top Contributor , Twitter | Linkedin | Community Profile | Ad-Globe
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Re: Three Question Regarding EFPB & ETPB

Explorer ✭ ✭ ☆
# 7
Explorer ✭ ✭ ☆

Hi Mike.

 

As Moshe here (and myself on LinkedIn, I'm Pierre over there), practically, it does not matter much how often the estimate are re-calculated. It's a constantly moving target so there's a margin of error and like a computer, obsolete the minute your buy it.

 

I think your question is really, how is it calculated? Probably pretty much as one would expect: given the information available at that moment (bold and underline "at that moment" which is when the calculation occurred), given your QS you would have to bid $x to achieve the goal or at least get closer to it. But your mileage may and probably will vary.

 

Is it accurate? More or less.

 

Is it helpful? In some ways, less so if not accurate. As Moshe said, "first shot". I tend not to pay much attention to those estimates once a campaign is running the way I want.

 

How often is it calculated? No real idea. Once a week should be enough given the variables.

 

Based on Google search only? Most probably. Google has ready access to their own data which makes it easy. And there can be big differences between them and their search partners. FYI, your QS is also based only on results in Google.

 

Based on exact matches? Again, most probably since QS are also calculated that way.

Re: Three Question Regarding EFPB & ETPB

Top Contributor
# 8
Top Contributor

Hi Mike,

 

Lucid_Marketing wrote, "Based on Google search only? Most probably. Google has ready access to their own data which makes it easy. And there can be big differences between them and their search partners. FYI, your QS is also based only on results in Google."

 

I just want to mention that keywords have a QS on search partners, also. But the QS that you see in the UI is the QS for Google search only. There is also a QS on the display network, but we never see those numbers.

 

I usually look at the Bid Simulator to see how many extra clicks I might get with a higher bid. I do not always bid the amount shown to get those clicks. I do watch the average position.

 

Best of Luck!

 

Pete

 

 

 

petebardo -- Deadhead doing AdWords

Re: Three Question Regarding EFPB & ETPB

Explorer ✭ ✭ ☆
# 9
Explorer ✭ ✭ ☆

>> I just want to mention that keywords have a QS on search partners, also. But the QS that you see in the UI is the QS for Google search only.

 

Correct. My post made it sound like the SPs don't have a QS.

Re: Three Question Regarding EFPB & ETPB

Top Contributor
# 10
Top Contributor

@Lucid_Marketing;

Please connect with me on LinkedIN (No contact  on your profile page)

Moshe, AdWords Top Contributor , Twitter | Linkedin | Community Profile | Ad-Globe
Did you find any helpful responses or answers to your query? If yes, please mark it as the ‘Best Answer’