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Duplicate Keywords in Different Ad Groups vs. Campaigns - Does this drive up your bids?

Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭
# 1
Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭

When you place duplicate keywords in different ad groups, does it drive up your bids or does only one ad from your campaign or account enter into an auction?

 

My instinct is that placing duplicate keywords in different campaigns would be worse than placing them in different ad groups. 

 

 

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Accepted by rashu (Google Employee)
September 2015

Re: Duplicate Keywords in Different Ad Groups vs. Campaigns - Does this drive up your bids?

[ Edited ]
Top Contributor Alumni
# 2
Top Contributor Alumni

here is what google officially says about duplicate keywords

"Avoid duplicate keywords across ad groups.
Google shows only one ad per advertiser on a particular keyword, so there's no need to include duplicate keywords in different ad groups or campaigns. Identical keywords compete against each other, and the better-performing keyword triggers your ad."

Ref: http://support.google.com/adwords/bin/static.py?hl=en&page=tips.html&rd=1

So it applies to ad group as well as campaigns but why do you actually want duplicate keywords in your campaign?

Regards

Nik

 

Regards, Nik
LinkedIn  |   @nikhilparachure | My Blog

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Accepted by rashu (Google Employee)
September 2015

Re: Duplicate Keywords in Different Ad Groups vs. Campaigns - Does this drive up your bids?

Top Contributor
# 6
Top Contributor

Hi GOGIAGO,

 

The duplicate keywords will 'compete' in a mini auction before the ad enters the actual auction. In other words, the keyword with the higher ad rank will win the competion within your account and enter into the general placement auction. It doesn't necessarily mean your bid or CPC will be higher because of this.

 

If these are broad match keywords, it will be difficult to predict which keyword would be selected--and a little less difficult for phrase match and much more predictable for exact match. That's because the QS is calculated for each auction. While the QS you see in your account is all based on exact match, the actual QS of your keywords can change considerably depending on the actual query.

 

In your case, wanting to spliit test two landing pages on different domains, I think "experiments" would work nicely. The ad goup would be duplicated, but the keywords would not act like duplicates. The traffic should get split evenly between the live campaign and the experiment.

 

BEst of Luck!

 

Pete

 

petebardo -- Deadhead doing AdWords

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Marked as Best Answer.
Solution
Accepted by rashu (Google Employee)
September 2015

Re: Duplicate Keywords in Different Ad Groups vs. Campaigns - Does this drive up your bids?

[ Edited ]
Top Contributor Alumni
# 2
Top Contributor Alumni

here is what google officially says about duplicate keywords

"Avoid duplicate keywords across ad groups.
Google shows only one ad per advertiser on a particular keyword, so there's no need to include duplicate keywords in different ad groups or campaigns. Identical keywords compete against each other, and the better-performing keyword triggers your ad."

Ref: http://support.google.com/adwords/bin/static.py?hl=en&page=tips.html&rd=1

So it applies to ad group as well as campaigns but why do you actually want duplicate keywords in your campaign?

Regards

Nik

 

Regards, Nik
LinkedIn  |   @nikhilparachure | My Blog

Re: Duplicate Keywords in Different Ad Groups vs. Campaigns - Does this drive up your bids?

Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭
# 3
Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭

So I understand that they "compete" but what I'm trying to understand is if they compete in the auction or before the auction. 

 

One situation we have run into is wanting to split test two landing pages with two different domains (since one is a sign up page hosted in eventbrite, it has a diff domain). You can only have one domain per ad group. 

Re: Duplicate Keywords in Different Ad Groups vs. Campaigns - Does this drive up your bids?

Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭
# 4
Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭

Use the Find Duplicate Keywords tool to locate keywords that are repeated in your account, campaign, or ad groups.

  1. Go to the Tools Menu > Find Duplicate Keywords or go to the View Menu > Duplicate Keywords.
  2. Select the part of your account where you want to search for duplicates. Check the box next to the account name to search the whole account, or select specific campaigns or ad groups.
  3. Select the criteria for your search, including:
    • Word order Does the word order matter? Select 'Strict word order' to treat 'buy shoes' as a different keyword from 'shoes buy.' Select 'Any word order' if word order doesn't matter.
    • Match types Does the same keyword with a different match type qualify as a duplicate?
    • Location of duplicates Do you want to find duplicates only when they exist within the same ad group or the same campaign, or do you want to find any duplicates across the entire account?
    • Optional: Hide duplicates You have the option to hide duplicates in deleted, ended, or paused, campaigns and ad groups.
  4. Click Find Duplicate Keywords.

The duplicate keywords appear in a list on the Keywords tab, where you can edit or delete them as necessary. Learn about quick selection of duplicate keywords. Tip: If you have a large number of duplicate keywords, sort the list using column

Re: Duplicate Keywords in Different Ad Groups vs. Campaigns - Does this drive up your bids?

Explorer ✭ ☆ ☆
# 5
Explorer ✭ ☆ ☆

Hello

 

the keywords will compete with each other so will drive up your own costs.

 

With regards to split testing two landing page you could run an ACE to find this out. This will probably be the best way to do this if your landing pages have two different domains.

 

Cheers

Kane

Marked as Best Answer.
Solution
Accepted by rashu (Google Employee)
September 2015

Re: Duplicate Keywords in Different Ad Groups vs. Campaigns - Does this drive up your bids?

Top Contributor
# 6
Top Contributor

Hi GOGIAGO,

 

The duplicate keywords will 'compete' in a mini auction before the ad enters the actual auction. In other words, the keyword with the higher ad rank will win the competion within your account and enter into the general placement auction. It doesn't necessarily mean your bid or CPC will be higher because of this.

 

If these are broad match keywords, it will be difficult to predict which keyword would be selected--and a little less difficult for phrase match and much more predictable for exact match. That's because the QS is calculated for each auction. While the QS you see in your account is all based on exact match, the actual QS of your keywords can change considerably depending on the actual query.

 

In your case, wanting to spliit test two landing pages on different domains, I think "experiments" would work nicely. The ad goup would be duplicated, but the keywords would not act like duplicates. The traffic should get split evenly between the live campaign and the experiment.

 

BEst of Luck!

 

Pete

 

petebardo -- Deadhead doing AdWords

Re: Duplicate Keywords in Different Ad Groups vs. Campaigns - Does this drive up your bids?

Participant ✭ ✭ ✭
# 7
Participant ✭ ✭ ✭

Peter,

 

Do you think this

 

The duplicate keywords will 'compete' in a mini auction before the ad enters the actual auction. In other words, the keyword with the higher ad rank will win the competion within your account and enter into the general placement auction. It doesn't necessarily mean your bid or CPC will be higher because of this.

 

also applies to ads within the same ad group, so that a text ad and an image ad within the same ad group in a cpc campaign doesn´t compete for the same ad space in an actual auctions, thus driving up ad rank threshold and price, but instead compete with each other "on beforehand"?

Re: Duplicate Keywords in Different Ad Groups vs. Campaigns - Does this drive up your bids?

Top Contributor
# 8
Top Contributor

Hi David,

 

Yes, that is true,  but it's a little different with a DN campaign with both image and text ads. Generally speaking, I set up separate ad groups for display and text ads, because not all AdSense sites accept image ads. And, since image ads often occupy 3 ads units or more, the bids for image ads needs to be higher. But I often also include a text ad in the group for fall back.

 

If the site does accept image ads, the image group wins. If not, the text ad wins the mini auction. The winner of the mini-auction within the account enters into the general auction. The thing is, you can not adjust the bid depending on the ad shown. If you place text ads in the same group with image ads, the bids should be set high enough for the image ads to display and that is often quite a bit more than bids for text ads. If you place text ads in the same group with image ads, you are effectively bidding higher for the text ad and that could lead to a higher CPC.

 

The question was "Does this drive up your bids?", to which I will answer, "most likely, but not necessarily your CPC".

 

Oh, this is a true statement, "so that a text ad and an image ad within the same ad group in a cpc campaign doesn´t compete for the same ad space in an actual auctions".

 

Pete

 

petebardo -- Deadhead doing AdWords

Re: Duplicate Keywords in Different Ad Groups vs. Campaigns - Does this drive up your bids?

JJO
Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭
# 9
JJO
Visitor ✭ ✭ ✭
Does this apply to duplicate keywords within different ad groups within the same campaign or within multiple campaigns? I have several duplicate keywords within several ad groups scattered across many campaigns each with different geo-targeting and keyword match types. Are you saying that is incorrect and will drive up my bids?

Re: Duplicate Keywords in Different Ad Groups vs. Campaigns - Does this drive up your bids?

Participant ✭ ✭ ✭
# 10
Participant ✭ ✭ ✭

Ji JJO

 

Do you mean you have you have many identical keywords with identical match types in different ad groups across in your account?

That is not recommended as it just makes your campaign hard to analyze, and it does signify that your account is not well structured.

 

Or do you mean that you have identical keywords with different match types (which, technically speaking is not the same keyword) in different ad groups in your account?

That is perfectly fine and sometimes recommeded (a matter of taste also, how you prefer to structure your account)

 

On the other hand, if duplicates are in campaigns with different geo targeting, you don´t have a problem. They don´t compete on the same geographical market.

 

I´d say same keyword with different match type does not drive up bids as long as bids for these keywords are the same (at least if they also have the same quality score).